IGIHE.com twaganiriye na André Martin Karongozi akaba ari uwunganira ababurana bita Avoka mu rugaga rw’abavoka b’ u Rwanda n’ab’i Buruseli mu Bubiligi, yigeze no kuyobora umuryango wa Ibuka-Belgique, tuganira k’umuhango wo gushyingura aho yaherekeje umubyeyi we Mukandoli Xaverina waguye mu Cyanika mu gihe cya jenocide yakorewe Abatutsi.
Muri uwo muhango hashyinguwe abantu barenga ibihumbi 25, icyo gikorwa cyamaze iminsi itatu hashyinguwe abantu bari mu byobo bitatu byari kuri Paroisse ya Cyanika, hari abandi bashyinguwe ariko batari muri ibyo byobo babashije kumenyekana.
Muri abo babashije kumenyekana harimo Padiri Niyomugabo Joseph, Mukantwali Pélagie n’umwana we Ikirezi Théodette, na Mukandoli Xaverina (Nyina wa Karongozi André Martin), Kambuga Elisabeth, Nyirantorwa Marie Goretti, Uwamahoro Jovania, Ndateba Vianney, n’Umutoni. Hashyingurwa kandi n’undi muntu utaramenyekanye.
Hashyinguwe na none Ngarambe Juvénal na Mutwewingabo Jean Marie Vianney baguye i Kigali mu Nyakabanda imiryango yabo ikifuza ko bashyingurwa hamwe n’abandi mu Cyanika.
Ikiganiro kirambuye Umunyamakuru wa IGIHE Karirima A, Ngarambe yakigiranye na André Martin Karongozi.
Dore uko ikiganiro cyari kimeze
IGIHE.com: Mu minsi ishize mwagiye gushyingura abo mu muryango wanyu, ese byagufashije iki cyane ko jenoside yabaye utari no mu Rwanda, ni iki wakoze kugirango ibyo bintu bimenyekane ababikoze bahanwe? . Hanyuma se nyuma yo gushyingura umwe mu babyeyi bawe wumva umeze ute?
Karongozi André Martin : Urakoze ndagushimiye ko watekereje kumpa uyu mwanya wo gusubiza k’ubibazo twese bitureba. Ikintu cya mbere cyo nakubwira ni uko umuntu utari hano muri Jenoside burya hari ubundi buzima aba arimo ubuzima bwo kwibaza uko byagenze, bwo kwibaza ukuntu abaturanyi abantu bari inshuti bakwiciye abawe, umuryango wawe, kwibaza ukuntu bishwe n’uburyo bishwemo.
Ni ukuvuga mbese muri make akababaro, ishavu, agashinyaguro mbese uburyo bishwe nabi n’ikibazo jyewe mporana mu mutwe wanjye cyo kuvuga ngo uwambwira uko bari bamerewe, noneho bikagera naho ushobora no kumva yuko hari icyo utabashije kubamarira, biri mubyo rero umuntu aba aharanira byo kuba wavuga uti byibuze ngize umwanya wo gushyingura umuvandimwe, inshuti cyangwa se umubyeyi, rero sinzi uko umuntu yabona agaciro akagereranya ko kujya mu gikorwa nk’icyo.
Kuba mu Bubiligi nyuma ya jenoside mu muryango wa Ibuka byaranyubatse cyane kuko nabaye nkaho jyewe ndi hafi yibyabaye mu Rwanda no gushyingura kuriya nubwo bwari ubwa mbere ngiye kureba amagufa, tugiye kuyoza no gushyingura n’ibindi bikorwa bikorwa muri urwo rwego, kuba nari kumwe n’abacitse ku icumu mu Bubiligi nkajya mu mihango yo kwibuka nkumva ubuhamya bwabo nkareba n’amafilimi ajyanye nabyo ni nk’aho byanteguye kujya gushyingura abantu bangana kuriya kuko twashyinguye i Cyanika imibiri y’abantu barenze ibihumbi 25 harimo na Mama wambyaye n’abandi b’inshuti nk’uwari Padiri mukuru waho, umugore witwa Perajiya n’abandi bantu b’inshuti abitwa ba Ngarambe na Mpatswe n’umugabo n’abandi, navuga ko ari nkaho nari nariteguye.
Navuga ko gushyingura ukanumva ko ku bwawe umutima uruhutse bigasa naho ugize akamaro ariko nyuma ukaza kuvuga uti : « Ibyo nkoze ni akantu kangana urwara mbese n’igitonyanga mu nyanja, ariko abantu barapfuye ariko ntacyo mbahaye byibuze cyubahiro, ntabwo byoroshye kubisobanura ariko mu magambo make ndumva ari nk’uko nabibabwira.
IGIHE.com : Nyuma yo kubikora nubwo wabikomojeho, wowe byakumariye iki byagusigiye iki ?
Karongozi André Martin : Iyo ugeze aho bikorerwa, ukuhagira imibiri ibihumbi 25 irenga, byasabye ko haba abantu benshi babikora, jye rero nabonye ukuntu abantu bakoreraga muri gahunda cyane cyane abagore nibo bozaga imibiri, umuntu agafata umwanya we, bakabiha umwanya ungana uhagije bagombaga kuba barimo bakoramo ibindi , iyo urebye abo bantu babikora ubona bafite ubushake butinuba nibwo ubona ko koko umuntu afite agaciro nubwo aba yarishwe, icyo nshaka kuvuga ni uko abo bantu abenshi batabaga buhagira abo bazi gusa cyangwa abavandimwe ba hafi gusa, ahubwo basubizaga ubumuntu inzirakarengane, kuri jye kwari kuhagira Mama wambyaye byari ibindi bindi, iyo urebye abo bantu umwanya bafashe kuko byamaze ukwezi n’igice kurenga niho uvuga uti nari nkwiye rwose gushimira n’aba barimo boza abishwe kubera agaciro babihaye, n’urukundo udashobora kugira uko ugereranya rwabo bantu bitanga bagakora icyo gikorwa ntagereranywa.
Ikimbabaza nuko ntabona umuntu ku giti ke ngo mbe na mushimira ku giti cye kuko bari benshi, ariko turi mu misango ya misa no gushyingura narabatekereje cyane n’abandi batanze infashanyo zitandukanye yaba mu mafaranga n’ ibikoresho binyuranye byakoreshejwe icyo gihe , akazi bakoze karakomeye cyane kuko si ukoza gusa.
Babaga batandukanya abantu bishwe n’imyenda babaga bambaye bicwa bakayanika ahantu kugirango yumuke, bagenda batoranya n’udukoresho twabaga turikumwe n’amagafu nk’udupira tw’abana bakinaga nk’udukoresho batwaragamo amatushi yo kwishuri ndetse n’agakongoro k’umubyeyi yari yazanye yitwaje amata y’umwana yarahetse, nk’inkono yitabi y’umusaza wishwe nawe bakagenda babitoranya byose bakabishyira ku ruhande tukabibona, icyo cyarantangaje cyane.
Nagiyeyo inshuro zitari nkeya mva i Kigali njya mu Cyanika kuko numvaga buri gihe hari icyo nunguka ariko kitari ku giti cyanjye ahubwo harimo no gushaka kuba hafi yabo bantu barimo bakora ako kazi katoroshye ngo mbahe icyubahiro kubera ibyo barimo bakora kandi batabihatiwe.
Nsanze umuntu ari ubusa twari dukwiye kujya tubyibuka tukanabyandika n’ahantu aho kuzamura intugu no kwishyira hejuru, tukibuka ko habayeho Abagabo n’Abagore bafite agaciro gakomeye nkuko ya ndirimbo y’abadivantisite ibivuga ngo n’iki watanze… hari abasore beza hari ababyeyi bimfura ukavuga uti uwampa kujya mfata agaciro bari bafite n’uburere bari bafite n’icyubahiro bari bafite nkabirwanira tukabishyira ahantu umuntu akajya abireba akibuka, nti uwajya yereka abantu bose ibi bintu noneho umuntu wumva ko ari igitangaza akagerageza gushyira mu gaciro no kugabanya ubukaka.
Dore uko Karongozi yabonaga Nyina n’abandi bishwe
Karongozi André Martin avuga ukuntu yabonaga nyina umubyara yagize ati : « Mama umbyara yari umubyeyi watwibarutse turi batandatu, araturera turakura, anarerera rubanda, abanira benshi, abo yahungiyeho bamwishe bari bamuzi neza nta kibi yari yarabagiriye. Izi ni ingero mu zindi nyinshi.
Abaguye aha mu Cyanika bose turahamya ko bazize akamama. Ko kandi buri wese yari afite ishusho ye, imigenzereze ye, impano ze zitandukanye, aribyo bishyizwe hamwe byari amaboko y’u Rwanda n’umuzi w’Isi.
Umusizi Bagorozi niwe ugira ati :« Abana ni bo ba se b’abantu » . Ngicyo icyo tugomba kwibutsa no gushimangira uyu munsi niba tudashaka kugoreka amateka. Abishe nabo barazwi, n’abataramenyekana bariyizi. Aboretse imbaga y’abantu ibihumbi byatsinzwe mu Cyanika nabo n’imbaga.
Abacu bishwe n’abaturanyi babo bafatanije n’abayobozi b’iki gihugu b’icyo gihe. Bishwe n’abaturanyi babo bahanaga umuganda, baratabaranaga, basabanaga umuriro n’amazi. Bishwe na bagenzi babo basangiye amashuri, akazi kanyuranye. Bishwe n’abo bakamiye, abo bareze, abo bigishije, urungano batobanye akondo.
Twemera ko gendarmerie, abasilikare, interahamwe n’Impuzamugambi n’abayobozi b’Igihugu cyose babashishikarije kwica bagenzi babo. Ariko biragoye kwiyumvisha icyabateye kubica urw’agashinyaguro bazi neza ko babaziza ubusa.
Biragoye kumva ko umuntu ahimbazwa no kwambika umukambwe ubusa ukamwica urubozo. Biragoye kumva uko umuntu afomoza umubyeyi, akica impinja n’ibitambambuga mu bubabare burenze kamere. Ababishe batyo bari bazi icyo bakora kuko nabo bafite umubiri, bafite ubwenge n’umutima, n’uwaba atarabyaye yarabyawe, ntibari bayobewe ko umwana, umubyeyi ari nk’undi. Ibi bisobanuye ko abacu batari bakwiye urupfu nk’urwo bishwe. Ubundi ngo “Impyisi y’iwanyu ikurya ikurundarunda”. Ababishe kandi babazi ntibabaciriye n’akar’urutega.».
IGIHE.com : Mu kazi kawe nta kibazo uhura nacyo bitewe nijambo wavugiye i Cyanika ?
Karongozi André Martin : Nta kubeshye akazi kacu tuba ku karubanda ariko ijambo navuze abantu bariteze amatwi kandi navuze ingeri zose z’abantu bari muri iki gihugu muri jenoside, ari abiciwe ari abishe n’abagerageje gufasha ababahungiragaho icyo gihe, ariko abantu ntabwo babyumva kimwe, icyo ni icya mbere.
Icya kabiri NI uko byari ngombwa ko ijambo nk’iryo rivugwa kuko abantu barigengesera, icyo nkeka cyabatangaje n’uko nashoboye kuvaga ibyo navuze kandi ngo mvuye i Burayi ! ikindi navuze ijambo rijyanye nigikorwa cyarimo gikorwaicyo gihe, noneho hakaba nuko aho navugiye ari iwacu ku ivuko, muri Paruwasi yanjye niho nabatirijwe niho Data yakoze arahigisha niho umuryango wanjye bawiciye k’uburyo ayo mateka arazwi nayabayeho mbere ya jenoside arazwi nayo muri jenoside arazwi naya nyuma yayo arazwi, hari nabari baravuze ko napfuye ariko nkeka ko ari amakuru yatangwaga nabi wenda kubera izindi nyungu, cyakora mu gihe twashyinguraga hari n’abandi benshi batahavuka bari baje kudutabara bo mu ngeri nyinshi zitandukanye za Leta n’abandi.
Icyo nishimiye ni uko abateguraga bamwe twajyaga dukorana amanama banyemereye kuvuga kuko sijye wabisabye kuko wenda bumvaga ko mbikeneye kubera ubushishozi bakoresheje mbashimira, bampa n’umwanya batari bahaye abandi, nakumenyesha ko hari undi mugore wari wavuye Oslo aje gushyingura abantu biwabo, n’Umupolisi mukuru uhavuka hariya wari wavuye Darfour aje gushyingura abe, aricyo cyamuzanye bose batse uruhushya aho bakora bo bari n’ahano muri jenoside ibyo byose n’ibintu bikwereka yuko cyari igikorwa abantu bakomeyeho kandi bakomeje gukomeraho kuburyo butangaje.
Urumva rero jyewe nagize imana zo guhabwa umwanya wo kuvuga ijambo ndivuga nemye kuko numvaga mvugira imbere yaho umubiri wa Mama nari naje gushyingura uri nabyo bintera imbaraga cyane kandi bambwiye ko bashimye ibyo navuze.
Ubwo yashyinguraga umubyeyiwe Karongozi yasoje ijambo rye muri aya magambo :
“Nagirango nsozereze aha kubera gahunda ndende iteganijwe. Ariko nshimiye abampaye aka kanya ko gushyingura kuko ntabishoboye mbere ya none. Nabaga mu Bubiligi niho mu kwa munani muri 94 twafatanije n’abantu b’ingeri nyinshi dushinga umuryango Ibuka dushimishwa nyuma n’uko izina ryanyuze n’Abanyarwanda benshi ubu imiryango ifite iryo zina ikaba iri henshi mu bihugu bitandukanye. Mbashimiye rero ko mwampaye akanya ko guherekeza Mama ntari narabashije gushyingura. Mushyinguye mu izina ry’abandi bose barimo Sogokuru Ngirumpatse Daniel, n’Umukecuru we Xaverina, Data Karongozi Joseph, Masenge Mukanzeyimana Francine na Mubyara wacu Rose (mwene Gatwa)baguye aha mu Cyanika.
Mama kandi mushyinguye mu izina rya bashiki banjye Mukandoli Marie Josephine (n’umugabo we Manihura Simon Pierre), Mukarusine Clémentine (aha munyemerere nunamire mugenzi we Hasingizwe Alphonsine mwene Sakindi François na Mukamusoni Cécile bishe kuko yahishe Clémentine) na Mushiki wacu muto Dushimiyimana Jeanne, kimwe na Barumuna banjye Rusine Michel na Rusabana Clément baguye i Butare muri genocide.
Iri jambo kandi n’iryo guherekeza abantu bose bari baratabwe mu cyobo cy’inyuma y’ikigo cy’Abenebikira n’icy’ inyuma y’ahahoze Iseminali kimwe n’icyari ahahoze igihari cy’Abapadiri. Turazirikana rero abo bantu bose bazize Genocide dushyingura uyu munsi barimo ababyeyi, inshuti n’abavandimwe. »
Ngubu muri macye ubuhamya bwa Karongozi André Martin yabutangarije IGIHE.com.
Foto:Karirima
TANGA IGITEKEREZO